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Faceplams: Yeah, I was thinking about the same thing and that was a long and drawn out war, for sure.Originally Posted by Exocet
Exactly. The power vacuum gets filled by terrorist regimes.
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Yeah, I was thinking about the same thing and that was a long and drawn out war, for sure.
Exactly. The power vacuum gets filled by terrorist regimes.
Last edited by allegro; 10-01-2015 at 03:18 PM.
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Meanwhile, nobody outside of Chicago reported this.
WGN reports there were 60 dead in September.Through midday Tuesday (Sept 29), at least 250 shootings resulted in 55 people getting killed and 288 other people getting shot, according to data compiled by DNAinfo
14 shot in 15 hours.
Last edited by allegro; 10-01-2015 at 04:04 PM.
Active Member
I'm sorry, but this belongs in The Gun Thread, not random news. Rant, rant, rant. Oh wait, allegro, she makes intelligent arguments, let me bow down and kiss her ass. /rant.
I was nobody. Nothing.
Thank you. I sure hope you're right about all of this. China sure does make their military LOOK frightening in their parades and such.
My fears are speculative-you know, lines being drawn and crossed, and coalitions forming.
It's not ISIS i'm afraid of. It's Russia.
(btw, i'm still waiting for the other two episodes of that Frontline story to appear on the PBS streaming service. I fucking ADORE frontline. I think everyone should watch the one about the formation of ISIS)
So, as far as news, how about water on Mars? This article gets into what it all means.
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Yeah, Mars coverage is in the Spaaaaace thread in Speak Your Mind.
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Here is the New Yorker article about the Lockerbie guy:
http://www.newyorker.com/magazine/20...28/the-avenger
(I follow the New Yorker on Instagram; Instagram being the only social media I use, lol)
Last edited by allegro; 10-01-2015 at 11:10 PM.
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This Doctors Without Borders bombing is so fucked up. Whomever did this needs to be arrested and put on trial. That is way beyond a simple whoopsie.
Active Member
Agreed. I've been supporting this charity for years. My brother is running the NYC marathon raising funds for MSF. It pains me that the U.S. appears to FUBAR'd this so bad and doesn't seem to be taking responsibility. Admittedly, I've been busy and off the newswire the past couple of days so I don't know what our General testified to the other day...
In other news, who's going to win the Nobel Peace Prize tomorrow?
Active Member
The way certain portions of the press tried to hide this was really gross: https://theintercept.com/2015/10/05/...spital-attack/
And the way the US tried to continually avoid owning up to the bombing is also very telling: https://theintercept.com/2015/10/05/...justification/
US: sorry, collateral damage! ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
MSF: We repeatedly gave you our exact GPS location. We kept calling you during the sustained bombing. Oh, and the hospital was the ONLY thing on the entire compound that you took out.
US: Yeah well, you probably had a Taliban member inside... Maybe even shooting at our troops!
MSF: So you intentionally razed an operational hospital with 180 staff and patients? Thanks for the admission of a war crime! Also, not one of our staff reported hearing gunfire.
US: it was the Afghanistan Government's fault!
US: oops, i guess our Troops weren't actually under direct threat. The prior claims of such were an accident.
US: Obama says sorry!
As Obama recently said: "This is a political choice that we make, to allow this to happen every few months." except he wasn't talking about us bombing civilians..
There was a great aerial shot of the hospital showing it surrounded in fields. There was no way the US could have been trying to bomb anything else. I can't find the image right now so instead, ill give this:
#JustNobelPrizeWinnerThings
Last edited by DigitalChaos; 10-09-2015 at 10:06 PM.
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found it!
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What the FUCK. This just pisses me off so fucking much. If it wasn't intentional, it was a COLOSSAL fuckup. CRIMINALLY COLOSSAL.
Last edited by allegro; 10-09-2015 at 10:22 PM.
Active Member
It's infuriating, especially with how it is being handled. Greenwald brings up the painfully true point that this happens frequently, it's just that the MSF has a lot of clout with western counties and they aren't backing down.
The only scenarios I can image that actually lead to this :
- Enemy was being treated in the hospital and the US wanted them gone. (absolutely a war crime)
- Afghanistan, who dislikes the hospital, fed the target to the US. How the US would decided to bomb without validating the target or noticing that the location matches the MSF location? yea...
I just don't see where there is room for a fuckup that bad. MSF was constantly calling the US during the ~1hr long bombing to try and get them to stop.
I really hope this gets the full independent investigation that the MSF is pushing hard for. If there was some way to tie Hillary to this, the right would benghazi all over it... but that's not happening. It sounds like there is some higher level brass that would end up taking the fallout for this. Obama said an investigation from NATO & DoD would start, but MSF says it needs to be much more independent. MSF really doesn't trust the US.
The rare apology from Obama at least shows that we aren't going to deny it anymore.
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Or, to stay on a parallel topic, he's bringing a rubber dildo to a Glock duel...
I was nobody. Nothing.
i hate to editorialize here, but i feel pretty strongly that it was intentional.
And this makes me think back to Iraq claiming that we had bombed hospitals, all the way back to the first war.
I thought "oh, bullshit."
But now i feel pretty strongly that they were telling the truth.
The only reason we are being forced to apologize for THIS one is that the organization has international legitimacy-it's not just a claim by the government of the "enemy.'
Active Member
A short history of the U.S. bombing civilian facilities: https://theintercept.com/2015/10/07/...an-facilities/
That cover image is pretty great too...
Throbbing Member
I dont understand how they could have fucked up so bad here either...The U.S has been constantly present in Afghanistan for 14 years. And knows this area well, There is something seriously foul at play here. Maybe someone intentionally leaked the wrong information?? Seriously look at that map of the hospital!!???
Either way this is gold for the Russian propaganda machine.
Also about Turkey....not to be all doom and gloom,....but that country is seriously on the verge of a civil war...the amount of different groups disputing..and with corrupt President Erdogen...he is starting to resemeble Assad...its dangerously close to boiling point. People are saying he is responsible for the attack which left 128 dead the other day...targeting the Kurds...if this fucks up the implications will be oh so much bigger.
I hope Turkey does not go to shit, ive been there a few times, obviously had its problems but there was something different about it, i loved how it combines European and Middle Eastern cultures.
Either way..its looking dodgy.
Active Member
UT students receive death threats for organizing open carry dildo protest
http://www.deathandtaxesmag.com/2666...dildo-protest/
This is the perfect time for my often mentioned freedom device: AR-15 with a bayonet-mounted dildo. All of them would be 3D printed of course.
I really wish I lived near TX. Which of you TX people will take up the cause?!
kinda like so:
Stubby Member
Just because many militaries are now technologically advanced doesn't mean the fog of war doesn't still exist. Anything that happens outside a military's own bases can't be completely known and controlled.
Don't get me wrong: this is terrible. It probably is criminal. But that's what happens when you go to war, isn't it?
Active Member
Dude, the hospital was surrounded by empty fields. There is no fog of war possible. The US and Afghan govt were repeatedly told the exact GPS location of the hospital, is recently as 5 days before the bombing. The US also admitted that there were no active threats engaging them from the hospital, and that their previous claims of such were false.
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Obama-led drone strikes kill innocents 90% of the time
Well, this is going to be a cluster fuck. A new leaker has revealed some pretty shocking things about the drone program. Seems 90% of drone kills (all lead by Obama) have not been the intended targets. They just classify them as "combatants" so that we don't know.
full report here: https://theintercept.com/drone-papers/
ACLU and Amnesty are already asking for urgent investigations and much better transparency into the process.
Meanwhile, there was just a press call with the White House on Obama's new Afghanistan War policy. Remember all the times Obama and Biden promised we would be out of Afghanistan in 2014? Well, the very first question asked was "How will this impact Dem chances in 2016?" I think that says it all...
Stubby Member
That's pretty naive. I've seen confusion in all the corporate environments I've been in. I would never underestimate the amount of uncertainty that can exist in a warzone. It's easy to be an armchair general on the big decisions, but much harder to do so on individual tactics.
Anyway, that being said, it's hard for us sitting here to ever know the truth, after the fact. I'll just repeat: whether via the fog of war, or unleashed brutal human nature, this is what happens when nations go to war.
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@Timinator - I'm curious if you think that "fog of war" also applies to the 90% of people killed by drones who were not the intended targets.
The US has a constant problem with its war machine. This isn't even "nations going to war." Afghanistan is working WITH us. It's funny though, because Obama has repeatedly promised to get us out of Afghanistan by 2014.
Too Privileged to Get It
It's being reported on some outlets now that the US suspected the hospital of being used as a Taliban nexus. I don't have a link handy, but that looks like the story they're pitching now.
edit: here's a link, it's from MSN so I know it's pretty mainstream but I hardly ever read the news so, if anyone else has another source, i'd be interested to see it posted. http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/...upiY?li=AA54ur
Last edited by Demogorgon; 10-16-2015 at 11:42 AM.
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What a bunch of misogynistic idiots doxxing her and all.
UT bans dildos but not guns. That's the point.
If I was near Austin, I'd totes be there openly carrying a dildo. Maybe I'll just go over to Cabela's on Saturday and hang out in the gun section with a dildo.
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Yeah, that was quickly revoked as being false. The condensed timeline I posted here is accurate. Also note the continued attempts by the media to downplay it.
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Yesterday, a US tank forced its way into the MSF bombing site, unannounced. More property was damaged and possibly some of the evidence before the investigation could happen.
https://www.rt.com/news/318910-tank-...l-afghanistan/
Afghanistan must be really fucking foggy!
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Thing is, even if DID have Taliban in it, you don't BLOW UP the whole fucking hospital to get a few Taliban. Instead, you quietly infiltrate with a few operatives and see what's up and if there is Taliban, you get them from the ground without hurting innocent people in a hospital. Them's THE RULES. Otherwise, it's like bombing a daycare center because a gang member was in there. LAZY.
Re the above US tank:
Wtf. That's like driving your golf cart up onto the green, right next to the hole. LAZY.Members of a joint investigation team from the US, NATO and Afghan government were aboard the heavy military vehicle, Reuters reported citing a Medecins Sans Frontieres (MSF) statement on Thursday.
Last edited by allegro; 10-18-2015 at 09:11 AM.
Active Member
As almost hilariously symbolic this whole event is, that's far from being the first time a bunch of innocents are being bombed to a crisp based on such suspicions...
During WWII most of the cities around here were either razed or mostly destroyed during the liberation, but in that context I can understand it : You're trying to go fast, you need to get a bunch of enemies out fast and you can't afford to siege every fucking city, town or village. So yeah, you hope the civilians got out of the way and turn every hiding place to dust.
But here ? A ratio of 10 confirmed innocent civilians to 1 suspected potential terrorist, that doesn't sound quite alright...
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