NIN Confessions

[HWB]

I tend to stop listening to Broken after Gave Up.

It feels like the aggression has reached its peak and it is the logical ending to the EP to me, it is pretty clear the two other tracks weren't mean to be meant to be listened to after Gave Up, if that makes sense.

[tricil]

You're not wrong; they originally came on a separate 3" minidisc. But I didn't know that when I got my CD when I was a kid and, even though I know it's right to separate them, it doesn't feel like a complete experience for me without them. Which kinda drives me crazy. "Gave Up" is thematically the end.

The two tracks were supposed to come out on a 12” single during lollapalooza 91 anyway, they were “born” to be separate, so to speak.

I appreciate having them on a separate 7”. I’m team “broken ends at gave up” too

[eversonpoe]

"physical" & "suck" are my two favorite songs on broken (followed closely by "help me i am in hell") so ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

guess this should have gone in controversial opinions...

[HWB]

You're not wrong; they originally came on a separate 3" minidisc. But I didn't know that when I got my CD when I was a kid and, even though I know it's right to separate them, it doesn't feel like a complete experience for me without them. Which kinda drives me crazy. "Gave Up" is thematically the end.

This is why people who say "But Broken is longer than Bad Witch! Why isn't Broken an album?!" people drive me crazy since technically it's not longer at all.

[HWB]

Who the heck is griping about this?

I have a bad habbit of reading YouTube comments because I am curious about other people's insight into my favorite band and it is almost always terrible. Also seen this exact argument elsewhere though.

[tricil]

"physical" & "suck" are my two favorite songs on broken (followed closely by "help me i am in hell") so ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

guess this should have gone in controversial opinions...

Oh don’t get me wrong I love both songs, I just consider them to be a broken-era single more than part of the EP. they aren’t listed in the tracklist, they’re not in the Broken movie.

When I first heard them, they showed up minutes after gave up was done (how long was it from tracks 7-97?)

[HWB]

they’re not in the Broken movie.

To be fair, neither is "Last".

[Prettybrokenspiral]

Now might be a good time to confess that I'm Jesus Fuck, on ecstasy..

[HWB]

I thought it's just "Jesus Christ"

Oh, I just found out that he sings "Jesus Fuck" on And All That Could Have Been live album, the more you know!! JUust when I thought I was aware of all of the lyrical changes live.

[eversonpoe]

Oh don’t get me wrong I love both songs, I just consider them to be a broken-era single more than part of the EP. they aren’t listed in the tracklist, they’re not in the Broken movie.

When I first heard them, they showed up minutes after gave up was done (how long was it from tracks 7-97?)

approximately 90 seconds, i think? isn't each blank track approx. 1 second?

[TheBang]

Oh, I just found out that he sings "Jesus Fuck" on And All That Could Have Been live album, the more you know!! JUust when I thought I was aware of all of the lyrical changes live.

He actually says "Jesus fucked on ecstasy". He made this change starting on the Self-Destruct tour and pretty much ever since then. Prior to 1994, he sang it as "Jesus Christ"

[Jon]

approximately 90 seconds, i think? isn't each blank track approx. 1 second?

91 seconds even when removing the pre-gap from track 7.

[eversonpoe]

91 seconds even when removing the pre-gap from track 7.

love you

[Prettybrokenspiral]

He actually says "Jesus fucked on ecstasy". He made this change starting on the Self-Destruct tour and pretty much ever since then. Prior to 1994, he sang it as "Jesus Christ"

Actually, from our beloved NinWiki..

https://www.nin.wiki/Suck

Suck (And All That Could Have Been)

This live version is similar to the album version, but the ending is shortened, with Reznor shouting "Suck!" repeatedly rather than singing the song's final lyrics or returning to the verse beat and bassline. Also, the line "I'm Jesus Christ on ecstasy", Trent changes to "I'm Jesus fuck on ecstasy".

[TheBang]

Actually, from our beloved NinWiki..

...Also, the line "I'm Jesus Christ on ecstasy", Trent changes to "I'm Jesus fuck on ecstasy".

That needs to be corrected then.

It's pretty clear from the hundreds of recordings we have of it from 1994 on.

[Prettybrokenspiral]

That needs to be corrected then.

It's pretty clear from the hundreds of recordings we have of it from 1994 on.

Cool. I go by the only official live release of it and referenced the Holy Bible of NIN Knowledge, and it says I was right..

[HWB]

In a lot of ways, Hesitation Marks was sorta samiliar to the 90s album in sound as well, it didn't have the aggression TDS was known for at all but it marked the return to a bigger focus on electronics and a return to this "full" deep production with a lot of layers, and I felt like that 2000s albums were more minimal and had a certain feeling of being immediate but that was by design. I think Hesitation Marks was a big step stowards The Trilogy. It may not be obvious at first since it's really not noisy and Trent doesn't scream but apart from that I can hear some TDS in it, with how the song are build, are structured and how many layers there are. I spoke about this before, I think, but I think this opinion belongs here too.

[kaydraven]

In a lot of ways, Hesitation Marks was sorta samiliar to the 90s album in sound as well, it didn't have the aggression TDS was known for at all but it marked the return to a bigger focus on electronics and a return to this "full" deep production with a lot of layers, and I felt like that 2000s albums were more minimal and had a certain feeling of being immediate but that was by design. I think Hesitation Marks was a big step stowards The Trilogy. It may not be obvious at first since it's really not noisy and Trent doesn't scream but apart from that I can hear some TDS in it, with how the song are build, are structured and how many layers there are. I spoke about this before, I think, but I think this opinion belongs here too.

You make a lot of great points here and it hits on why I like Hesitation Marks so much. I never really thought about its connection to the Trilogy. Now I'm intrigued to go back and listen to them back to back to see the connections.

[HWB]

You make a lot of great points here and it hits on why I like Hesitation Marks so much. I never really thought about its connection to the Trilogy. Now I'm intrigued to go back and listen to them back to back to see the connections.

I think the Trilogy comparison is especially apparent in "Add Violence" especially, I consider that record like an extension of Hesitation Mark's ideas in a lot of ways, I can imagne "The Lovers" and "This Isn't The Place" fitting in quite nicely in there.

[botley]

Liking the discussion so far about NIN's arc toward a more layered production approach with Hesitation Marks that continued into the trilogy. It's interesting that, in some ways, Not the Actual Events took a very reactionary turn away from Hesitation Marks, what with its aggressive, loud n' heavy approach; then for Add Violence they doubled back into a little more of the moody beat-programming and intricate-sound-design realm, before apparently throwing another EP attempted in that vein out the window and hitting on a weird new style, halfway between the 90s aggro and the heady modern feel with Bad Witch.

That style has now sort of weirdly hybridized with the soundtrack scoring stuff, birthing the new Ghosts V–VI releases. I have to say, I'm still adjusting to it. Hearing them break down "The Lovers" and especially "God Break Down the Door" into multi-track layers that are then analyzed in detail (for Song Exploder and MwtM, respectively) has thrown this all into a new light, for me. Coming off the back of the excellent Watchmen scores and also the stunning Waves & Bird Box Extended ones... it's hard to process how much amazing technique is on display. Having so much new music to absorb every year is really incredible, but also kinda overwhelming.

Very excited to hear how Mank turned out, with them scoring a full orchestra the entire way through! Nothing like that currently exists in NIN's canon.

[kaydraven]

Admittedly, I'm not the biggest fan of the instrumental stuff. I still don't like Ghosts I-IV. But I was very happy when NIN dropped Ghosts V-VI and I actually like it more than the first collection. It felt more cohesive than the previous Ghosts release and it came at the right time. It was the start of lockdown, which meant I was alone and stuck in the house while already depressed. And listening to the album captured what I was feeling. But I also am very excited for the next vocal NIN album!

[HWB]

I consider Ghosts V-VI proper albums as much as TDS or The Fragile, I feel they are just as important.

[eversonpoe]

Proper albums, definitely. Just as important, perhaps. But on the heels of two years that saw the release of...five-and-a-half instrumental albums, probably a little less impactful.

i love them but i completely agree with this statement.

[HWB]

Proper albums, definitely. Just as important, perhaps. But on the heels of two years that saw the release of...five-and-a-half instrumental albums, probably a little less impactful.

I understand, time will be kind to these two releases when they'll be removed from the context of us getting so much instrumental work imho.

[Erneuert]

I've still barely listened to any of the soundtrack work.

[Erneuert]

Actually, from our beloved NinWiki..

https://www.nin.wiki/Suck

Suck (And All That Could Have Been)

This live version is similar to the album version, but the ending is shortened, with Reznor shouting "Suck!" repeatedly rather than singing the song's final lyrics or returning to the verse beat and bassline. Also, the line "I'm Jesus Christ on ecstasy", Trent changes to "I'm Jesus fuck on ecstasy".

Is it fuck or fucked? I never could quite tell.

[piggy]

I've still barely listened to any of the soundtrack work.

I've listened to all of it once on YouTube, but have never returned to any of it. This makes me wanna go back to The Vietnam War score, though. And I still wanna hear the expanded Bird Box stuff someday, too.

[Graz]

Referring to Suck live, it is clearly fuck with a hard K at the end on AATCHB. Not sure about other recordings.

[muad'nin]

I've still barely listened to any of the soundtrack work.

What have you listened to in full? Any interest in delving in, or is it just not to your taste?

[Erneuert]

What have you listened to in full? Any interest in delving in, or is it just not to your taste?

I listened to all of Ghosts and enjoyed/enjoy it all. And Quake, and parts of TGWTDT and liked a lot of that. Those aside, I’ve just never put the time aside to fully listen to and digest everything else. It’s kind of like knowing about a movie and knowing it’s good, but keep on putting off watching it. Kinda like what I did with the John Wick movies, but those I did eventually get around to watching.

I think so many things came out in succession that I just found it overwhelming and just kept on putting off listening to it all. Only listened to the first half of Together with regard to that Ghosts release. Haven’t reached Locusts yet.

I need to put a playlist together if all the soundtrack work and just digest it all over a couple of nights and familiarise myself properly. I remember Great Bird of Prey in particular. And all of Quake. Those are very much to my palette.