Random General Questions

[Volband]

Handshake etiquette in the US is basically identical regardless of gender, so when I'm introduced to someone in a group I introduce myself to everyone/shake their hand.

It is extremely rare here when girls shake hands with others. If we already know each other, we usually just kiss the cheeks, or say hi. On the other hand, guys always shake hands. It was the latter I initially googled about handshake etiquette, because it is so damn frustrating, when there are like 10 guys grouped together and I'm always like wtf am I supposed to do?

Yes.

And I have never in my life taken a world history class - but I've taken probably 4 US history classes.

You can TAKE classes in elementary and secondary schools?! That sounds like the worst and best idea ever.

Taught* amirite?

*_*

Ugh, this whole introducing yourself is so strange in Brazil. Super formal is 2 kisses, one on each cheek, yet sometimes when being introduced to friends of friends, they just go for one kiss, leaving me in an awkward "wait to see what they do next" phase. Also some people just stick their hand out and shake hands which isn't really traditional of Brazil...yet I'm seeing some people do that so who the fuck knows anymore.

Haha, somewhat same here with girls. One kiss? Two? Three? It's like a russian roulette, and if you lose, you are going to end up with either lip to lip kissing her, or moving in for a plus one awkwardly.

Guys only kiss on formal occasions, like during Christmas when you meet the family. But even then, we kiss the air. Unless some of your relatives are already piss drunk, and then they kiss you real good on your cheeks. Man, gotta love Christmas!

[allegro]

It is extremely rare here when girls shake hands with others. If we already know each other, we usually just kiss the cheeks, or say hi. On the other hand, guys always shake hands. It was the latter I initially googled about handshake etiquette, because it is so damn frustrating, when there are like 10 guys grouped together and I'm always like wtf am I supposed to do?

It isn't as cut-and-dry in the U.S, either. You have to know religious or cultural backgrounds and rules of class and social decorum. For instance, if you are, say, in NYC and are meeting Orthodox Jews, do not offer your hand or even touch them at all. When in the company of Muslims, there are also rules so it's probably best to wait until a hand is offered to you. If you are at a formal Black Tie event, do not offer your hand to a lady; wait until she offers her hand, first (rule of formal etiquette).

[Dra508]

If you are at a formal Black Tie event, do not offer your hand to a lady; wait until she offers her hand, first (rule of formal etiquette).

Geeze Muffy, are you a debutante or what?


@Volband Come to the U.S.

Formal/Professional
men shake hands
women shake hands
men and woman shake hands

Informal/Casual/21st century

First intro:
men shake hands
men and woman shake hands
woman shake hands, often I think they nod at each other or if far enough way, half wave hand

Departure
men shake hands - maybe go in for a handshake chest thump one armed hug


men cheek kiss woman, light hug
woman cheek kiss, light hug

Two handed handshake can mean two things - a. genuinely happy to see you

OR b. attempting to be dominate (big dick dominate)


I want to understand the international handshake. It looks like the beginning of an arm wrestle position not what we here in the U.S. see as a handshake.

[Sarah K]

I never experienced the cheek kissing thing until I moved to NYC. Since even hugging strangers is really weird for me, the cheek kissing makes me highly uncomfortable. I've lived here almost two years, and I'm still not adjusted to it at all.

[Rubeninphoenix]

Sarah, you never took a world history class? I thought that was like a universal requirement across the country in order to graduate HS.
@Volband In high school (secondary school as the rest of the world calls it) you pick your classes. You have to pick between core subjects like a math class, science, literature, etc but you also pick special fun classes called electives. For instance, my freshman (or first year) high school was like this: First semester I had English (literature/writing), Algebra (should've been geometry though), Physical Education, Earth and Space Science (think of it like geology and astronomy), History of Rock and Roll (yes this is an elective class my old HS offers and yes, all we did was watch concert DVDs and write reviews), and World History. As far as I know, you can't pick your classes in elementary school but maybe it's different in other states.

[allegro]

Geeze Muffy, are you a debutante or what?

My mother went to finishing school, Catholic boarding school, and had her "debut" lol. My grandparents were Etiquette Police. Even when we were really little.

Sarah, you never took a world history class? I thought that was like a universal requirement across the country in order to graduate HS.
@Volband In high school (secondary school as the rest of the world calls it) you pick your classes. You have to pick between core subjects like a math class, science, literature, etc but you also pick special fun classes called electives. For instance, my freshman (or first year) high school was like this: First semester I had English (literature/writing), Algebra (should've been geometry though), Physical Education, Earth and Space Science (think of it like geology and astronomy), History of Rock and Roll (yes this is an elective class my old HS offers and yes, all we did was watch concert DVDs and write reviews), and World History. As far as I know, you can't pick your classes in elementary school but maybe it's different in other states.

We had to take World History in high school. We started with electives at grade 7, not in elementary. I took "Poetry of Rock" as an English elective in High School (it was awful).

We had to take Earth Science, and the required text book was black with white text, "EARTH SCIENCE." On pretty much every copy, everybody had blacked out the bottom of the E and the whole H in Earth so that every book said:

FART SCIENCE

[Rubeninphoenix]

We had to take World History in high school. We started with electives at grade 7, not in elementary. I took "Poetry of Rock" as an English elective in High School (it was awful).

We had to take Earth Science, and the required text book was black with white text, "EARTH SCIENCE." On pretty much every copy, everybody had blacked out the bottom of the E and the whole H in Earth so that every book said:

FART SCIENCE

lol that is hilarious. I could've taken biology (that was my other science choice as a frosh) but I saved that for sophomore year (I ended up doing: Earth and Space Science, Biology, Physics, and Human Anatomy/Physiology). I don't have any funny stories regarding the textbook in either class though :/

[Sarah K]

Nope. I never had world history. My first high school only required one semester of history in the 4 years. The second one required two, but they were both US. One was the beginning of the white washed US history up until a certain point, and the second one was from that date to present.

[allegro]

I guess it varies by State (and maybe, in Sarah's case, school district?).

See CA's requirements, which include world history:
http://165.74.253.64/ci/gs/hs/hsgrtable.asp

I am pretty certain that ALL U.S. high school students must pass at least one semester of US History and one semester of US Government to graduate.

[Dra508]

Texas has a middle school class: Texas history. Does any other fucking state devote an entire semester to indoctrinate their children, but the lone star state? Random question.

I definitely had to take world history and a u.s. history in high school. There was a core course in college called West Civilization. That still around?

[Big Fat Matt]

As far as history courses go, most of elementary and middle school (ages 5-13) was 70% US History, 5% State History (Michigan) and 25% world history (Hitler is bad, England has a queen).

Once in high school, we had a "World Sciences" course our first year which covered history of man from the fertile crescent to roughly the time the US was formed. Sophomore year had "US History" which was obviously US centered, but did touch on major world events. Junior year had Government, which taught us how our government works (or doesn't) and Senior year i didnt take any history courses because I convinced my counselor to let me take another art class.

[allegro]

There was a core course in college called West Civilization. That still around?

I think the "World History" that is taught in U.S. Schools is pretty much the history of western civilization. It skips the rest of history, LOL.

Actually, at my college alma mater, "Survey of Western Civilization" (I and II) are electives under the "Western Culture" Gen Ed requirement. (Only one course required)

As far as history courses go, most of elementary and middle school (ages 5-13) was 70% US History, 5% State History (Michigan) and 25% world history (Hitler is bad, England has a queen).

LOL LOL LOL

We had to have three full semesters of social studies so I think that's why I ended up with World History as an elective. I'm not entirely sure that it was required, now that I think about it. I think we had so few "social studies" classes that you kind of run out of options. I know I took "Anthropology" and I took "Sociology" and I did sign up for the new "Psychology" class which fell under the "Social Studies" heading but dropped it after the first day when I found out that the instructor was the FOOTBALL COACH who kept calling the author of "Your Erroneous Zones" "Dr. Wayne DRYER." (wtf). I took "Child Development" but I don't remember if that was social studies or more of a "science" class.

[Baphomette]

I guess it varies by State (and maybe, in Sarah's case, school district?).

See CA's requirements, which include world history:
http://165.74.253.64/ci/gs/hs/hsgrtable.asp

I am pretty certain that ALL U.S. high school students must pass at least one semester of US History and one semester of US Government to graduate.

I took one year of World History, one year of US History and one semester each of European History, World Cultures, US Government/Politics and Economics. All required courses, from what I remember. But I went to a private school so I'm not sure if the courses were different in public schools.

My mother went to Catholic boarding school

Mine wasn't a boarding school but it was Catholic and all girls. Pretty crazy to think about now.

[allegro]

But I went to a private parochial school so I'm not sure if the courses were different in public schools.

*snort snort*

When I think "private" school, I think of this.

[Baphomette]

*snort snort*

When I think "private" school, I think of this.

Hold on, hold on. A parochial school is connected to a parish. Mine wasn't. So TECHNICALLY it is a private school. *hair flip* <--- very hard to do with short curly hair

[allegro]

Hold on, hold on. A parochial school is connected to a parish. Mine wasn't. So TECHNICALLY it is a private school. *hair flip* <--- very hard to do with short curly hair

If it's Catholic, it's Catholic. Wait, did you go to MARYMOUNT???? OH MY GOD, DO YOU KNOW THE KARDASHIANS??!??!?!!??!

[Ryan]

Ever wonder if, when another person brushes past you physically, they are being like a cat and want your affection?

[Vertigo]

Depends, did they stand on tiptoes, raise their tail and ensure you rubbed their scent glands?

[Ryan]

no lol

it was some old bartender

[ldopa]

Ever wonder if, when another person brushes past you physically, they are being like a cat and want your affection?

if you know the person, it can be a comfort thing. but there are 1999 mitigating factors as to why someone brushes up against you. especially in a bar setting.

[Ryan]

Does anyone here have access to magazine promo CDs / review copies of new albums?

I've been checking eBay religiously for a promo copy of Skeletons by Danzig, but come up bare. However, there have been people posting on other forums of receiving magazine and review copies, though none of them have surfaced.

If anyone can help hook me up with one it'd be Muchas Graciaz.

[elevenism]

Do we have a guitar thread?

if not, i or someone will and or should create one.

[ldopa]

the search turned up nothing for me. i tried a shit ton of key words.

[elevenism]

ok so ima make one

Also, what's the easiest way to upload pics to ets? i used to just upload the pic to imgur and link from there.

But now it's not working unless i'm logged in, and when i tried logging in, it's telling me that i am not, in fact, elevenism or tyler and someone has already registered an account with my email address and the code doesn't work and i;m ABOUT to fucking shoot myself trying to upload a pic of my new guitar.

[Volband]

I have a question...

I have an insufferable co-worker. Let's call him Tom. He's in his 50s, lives with his parents, not sure if he had a relationship (mentioning these so you can profile him), and he is very... strict? In a way that he likes order. A LOT. Tom has a spot for everything in the work-place. Like, there's a telephone and a water-machine, etc. and when he is in work he just can'T stand when they are not in their "right" place. He moves his finger over the desk or other equipment and complains how it was not cleane dproperly, he mainly does it with people who are new there. Like, once I started telling him that I don't care, I fucking cleaned it, so if he is still not satisfied than he should clean it himself, he stopped. Basically he can't really deal with people who don't give a crap about his bullshit.

Now, to give you ab etter profile... our shift used to change at 7 PM, and the guy who was supposed to take over his duty arrived with the train at 6:30. Now, that guy always told Tom that he is free to leave, after all, why should he be there for those final 30 minutes when he already arrived, right? Now, his train's schedule was later changed, so it arrived at 7:01. Tom rang the boss that how is that the shift change is at 7:00 and that guy arrives at 7:01?! The poor guy was forced to come with an earlier train....

It was kinda the same with me. I told him he can leave an HOUR earlier, because my other train would arrive 15 minutes after the scheduled shift, and I knew Tom would freak the fuck out, and did not even ask for any compensation. I was like... he can sleep an hour longer and I am not bored, so win-win ,right? No, he said no. The morning shift was at 7:20 and once I could have reached the train arriving at 7:19. We were about to meet halfway and he shoutingly asked me what the hell am I doing, I did not ask him to come in earlier. Like what the fuck, I don't even know his phone number (no one does) and how could I predict the train will be late so I might have a shot at reaching it? Anyway, Tom fucking turned around, forcing me to go back...

So basically Tom is a fucking jerk, not sure why, not just to me, but the rules were on his side in these examples.

However, this morning he kinda snapped, because while he was rambling about how the curtains MUST BE opened up by the end of the shift, I casually told him that's bullshit, and I don't care, and if he wants to open them, then he will open them himself. So, he went all psycho on me and grabbed my throat. But he was fast to realize that it's not exactly the smartest move, so he backed off immidietly, and I asked him what the fuck was he doing. He did not apply much force if any, so I'm not exactly sure if that's physical abuse or simply threatening.

My question is... what should I do? I long made peace with the fact that this guy can be a human piece of shit within the rules of the workplace, so if he doesn't want to come 5 minutes earlier so that I don't have to rot 1,5 hours for nothing, he doesn't have to, fine. But I'm pretty sure when he once shouted in my face and now when he grabbed my throat, it had to break some rules. I'm just not sure if it's worth it to press this cause. I mean, I really don't give a shit, like I'm not afraid to go to work or anything, I always bark back at him when he does his freakouts, so in a way I'm having fun. But I really want him to suck a big fat dick, so I'd like if the higher ups would actually punish him so I could laugh him in the face. However, we are lacking people there, and there is a high chance that if I go public, not only I won't reach anything, I might even get the short end of the stick somehow, being marked as the "one who runs to daddy" or something.

[playwithfire]

@Volband

First of all, from an outsider's perspective I think your coworker has some mental issues (as someone with OCD, it sounds like unmanaged OCD -- but that doesn't excuse exerting control over other people). You need to be documenting all of this. Write down what has previously happened, get your coworker who was involved to write it down as well, you'll need that if you escalate. As far as whether escalating is a good idea, that's your call. Personally, I would, but in the US this would be a fireable offense. If he won't lose his job for it, I could understand being wary of complicating that relationship, though that sucks.

Texas has a middle school class: Texas history. Does any other fucking state devote an entire semester to indoctrinate their children, but the lone star state? Random question.

I definitely had to take world history and a u.s. history in high school. There was a core course in college called West Civilization. That still around?

My school in AL did this as well.

[Baphomette]

@Volband

Personally, I would, but in the US this would be a fireable offense.

Not necessarily. If a person does suffer from a mental illness (and to me, it sounds like it could also be bipolar disorder) and their employer knows about it, the person is protected, up to a point. Mental illness is a disability and firing the disabled... can of worms companies try to avoid opening at all costs.

[playwithfire]

Huh, I didn't actually consider that it would be applicable to assaulting someone but you've got a point re: that being a can of worms.

[Volband]

That's the thing; I'm not sure if he indeed has some serious mental problem or he's just.... grown bitter, you know what I mean? Like, I can be an ass too, but I recognize that in order to have a healthy social life, one must make sacrifices and can not alienate everyone around him/her. He seems like someone who refused to give in to that, and he might have lived a life where he refused to meet people halfway, and his motto must be something like "I am right, for sure. Accept it, then we can be friends. Don't accept it, then you are an idiot." Like, I overheard a conversation, where he mentioned he has a facebook account, but he doesn't send friend requests. If others send him, then he gladly accepts, but he won't send any. So yeah, he has some crazy pride I just don't understand.

He won't get fired though, that's for sure. I will mention this to our boss, but you know how it is if you do it informally (the formal way is to write it down in the complaints book); he'll just say "aww, that's not nice. I'll talk with him!" and nothing will happen, because Tom will just say "yeah, but I was right to do what I did, case closed." Then we are back to square one, when he is an asshole, raises his voice, or says things like "only idiots like you won't do this" (which actually triggered my serious side, otherwise I would've just nodded off his usual bs), then I have to taunt him in hopes he gets physical and THEN I have the upper hand. But after a 14 hours long shift (even if it's not physically exhausting), I'm not always up to playing mind-games as the first thing in the morning and getting an adrenaline rush from the tension.

I think the biggest question whether to go on the formal way - because that leaves a mark, and the bosses can't just shush it away. But if I write down that he physically abused me, I might get screwed, because technically, he did not hurt me, so it was more like a threatening... you know, when it gets formal, minor things like that matter.

I'm also thinking about telling the boss to erase me from the list of people who wanted to participate in the next training course. It's basically almost a year long "school", where if you make it, you basically get promoted, and my workplace really needs those promoted people. I personally asked him that I am interested, we even had talks how if he puts is trust in me that once the training starts, I have to pull through it, etc. But it did not start, and with my withdrawal, I basically tell him that I am keeping my options free (getting that promotion locks me in to that workplace at least for a year I think) and might consider leaving. Tom is too old for that training course.
This is probably the weakest "blackmail" in history, but at the very least I can show them a middle finger if they let this thng unnoticed.

(and just between us, I was planning to leave anyway eventually, even after finishing that course; it was just a good alibi to be lazy for a year or two)

[allegro]

Huh, I didn't actually consider that it would be applicable to assaulting someone but you've got a point re: that being a can of worms.

You can't assault people, at work or at anywhere. It's always illegal. These are the types of behaviors in the U.S. workplaces that authorities want employees to report, even anonymously, due to some resulting in office shootings.

That was assault, whether the victim was "hurt" or not; in this country, anyway; you are entitled to a reasonable level of safety at work and employers can be found liable and subject to worker's compensation or personal injury lawsuits for these hairtrigger disgruntled employees.

The term "going postal" in the U.S. originates from a U.S. Postal employee who was burned out on his job, felt he was being treated unfairly, and eventually went to work and shot and killed a bunch of people. See this.

See also Vester Flanagan.

Even if this guy isn't a threat of going postal, he creates a hostile work environment for other employees, and he knows it, and he doesn't care. I could never work in that kind of environment for long with that kind of a control freak who actually assaults people on the job. Nobody and no law gives anybody a free pass to threaten the safety of employees or to create and/or maintain a hostile work environment. In the U.S., he could be arrested for assault and battery