If I Can’t Have Love, I Want Power - new Halsey album produced by Trent and Atticus

[Toadflax]

i think its about artistic integrity where popstars are generally regarded as just being commercial products with little to none artistic value

Exactly. People generalize an entire genre to make sweeping statements about the artists within that genre. Hyper-simplified statements like "rock good; pop bad" suggest that Nickelback and Creed are better than Madonna and Stevie Wonder.

[Toadflax]

Considering Troop's Attitude came out one week before Pretty Hate Machine, you could argue that Nine Inch Nails is just Trent's side project for when he's not producing pop records.

[WorzelG]

It will be exciting to see if something produced by TRAR could become a billboard hit! (Apart from Old Town Road of course)

[WorzelG]

Considering Troop's Attitude came out one week before Pretty Hate Machine, you could argue that Nine Inch Nails is just Trent's side project for when he's not producing pop records.

That’s amazing. Speaking of TR being dissed for doing poppier things, some guy made an incredibly pompous essay on the comments of the YouTube video of the Fashion performance which just made it seem like the guy had no idea who Bowie was, it was ridiculous

[Sarah K]

Remember that time Trent talked about his approach to writing hit pop songs for NIN? Wanna say it was around HM.

Are we pretending that NIN doesn't fall under the pop umbrella while having these performative meltdowns about pop music and musicians? Because I have some bad news, y'all.

[allegate]

the idea that gatekeepers exist for a production credit is both sad and hilarious. So what about "Even Deeper"? I loved the interview where Trent was talking about producing that song and comparing production styles with Dre.



Gotta be a fisheye lens giving Dre that shoulder pad, right?

wish we could have gotten a Dre-produced remix album of The Fragile just to hear what that could have sounded like.

[nihilmatters]

Trent and Atticus are dipping their toes into the production waters to ready themselves for the task of producing a Broadway show to complete their EGOT...that is all.

[Toadflax]

rant

So aside from your bizarre assumptions that Trent was unaware of Halsey and that the entire album was somehow made in the two months since the Oscars, your argument seems to be that if there's a discussion about marketability and money changing hands, then it's automatically not good / not art. Do you have any idea how this business works? Do you think "true artists" just make art without considering the business / marketing end and just somehow get famous?

[botley]

[Does Bill] have any idea how this business works?

That's self-evident.

[zecho]

Not liking pop music in general is normal, but not liking any pop music isn't a sign of taste. It's a sign of taking a convenient classification system so seriously that you lose track of what it's classifying. There's always been good pop music and there always will be. I'm personally super excited for this. I've never listened to Halsey, but I've been a fan of the direction pop music's been going since Lorde's debut.

Funny enough, the only two things I knew about Halsey before this announcement were 1. her hair is naturally curly, and 2. she's a big NIN fan. So this news made sense to me.

And just to remind everyone: TR wanted to produce for Aaliyah in 1999.

[Toadflax]

@Helpmeiaminhell What is it about TR that makes you think he’d do anything he doesn’t want to? Especially now that his schedule is what it is and all of the accolades he has now. He and Atticus can call their own shots essentially.

You want more proof? His response to Black Mirror and Miley wanting to use NIN songs.

This isn’t hard to figure out, dude. They wanted to do this. As I’ve said, I am not familiar with Halsey at all but I’m going to listen to it and see what I think. It may not be for me at all but do I think at this point, given the evidence, that TR/AR would do something they don’t want to do? No, I don’t.

I imagine we’ll hear something along the same lines as their score talk where they find it to be new and a challenge.

I bet there's an insane list of projects Trent and Atticus were offered a lot of money to participate in but turned down due to a lack of interest.

[Patrick_Nicholas]

I've been intentionally ignoring as much of what social media has to say about this production as possible, but some of the reactions suggest that people are taking issue with the simple fact that Halsey is a pop singer. I'm pretty sure they're some of the same people who threw a hissy fit over TR letting Miley get her hands on his music, and they probably also wish that Ariana Grande was killed in the Manchester bombing but probably wouldn't recognize her voice even if she were standing right behind them singing a medley of her hits.

The Twitter teaser suggests that Halsey might be trying to take a more experimental direction with this album, as opposed to hiring TR&AR to produce a conventional pop album, possibly inspired by their film scores but with vocals and more prominent percussion. In other words, the duo was most likely hired for a reason. The only Halsey songs I'm familiar with are her guest appearance on The Chainsmokers' "Closer" (sorry for reminding you of that song's existence) and her own song "Now Or Never", and I only vaguely remember the latter (pretty much just the chorus), so I am in no position to prejudge the album.

[makepacer]

I'm excited to check this out. I'm also not at all surprised by all of the reactionaries clutching their pearls, its always been a huge turn off of this and similar fan bases.

Call me crazy, but it seems that a lot of the bands that came up in the 80s and 90s - and are still going strong - are fucking bored. Trent and Atticus have mastered everything they've done, so producing a forward thinking "PoP STaR!" actually makes some of the most sense when it comes to projects outside of their comfort zone. I think someone said earlier in this thread that this could be a soft-launch of what could be their foray into musical theater for a Tony, and I wouldn't be surprised if that's the case.

Anyway, it's not new NIN and it's weird and different, but it's worth keeping in mind that if they only had NIN to work on, they might not be working at all anymore.

[Toadflax]

I've been intentionally ignoring as much of what social media has to say about this production as possible, but some of the reactions suggest that people are taking issue with the simple fact that Halsey is a pop singer.

It's funny; in the 90's, there was definitely this sense of, "if you listen to this kind of music, then you're not allowed to listen to that kind of music." But now, thanks to a combination of the music industry evolving and the fact that those of us who were teens in the 90's are adults now, that seems like a thing of the distant past. So it's silly and odd to me that there are still people like that in their 40's.

I might expect it more from fans of Korn or Disturbed or other bands that don't change much (not dissing those bands; just saying they tend to do one thing and stick to it), but that is definitely not NIN. I guess you still get those people at shows who don't want to hear anything non-hard-rock and don't want to hear new material (which is also weird to me considering they seem to be die hard fans of 5% of the NIN catalog and ambivalent to the rest but will still pay $100 to see the band live). So maybe those are the same people who get cranky seeing TR/AR taking on a pop project, those people who just want NIN to make Terrible Lie and Wish over and over again.

And don't get me wrong, I'm not saying people are un-evolved for preferring certain kinds of music, but it does come across as really immature to dismiss entire genres or assume something is going to be terrible before hearing it. Or you know, to get pissy and vocal when an artist you like decides to do something you might not like, as if they're there to serve you and only you.

[pcpunk]

Hot take: I will reserve judgement until I hear the music. Until then, I remain chuffed that my favorite musicians are active.

[botley]

Hot take: I will reserve judgement until I hear the music. Until then, I remain chuffed that my favorite musicians are active.

Hot take? Warm Breeze... and I'm with you.

[Demogorgon]

I mean, i don't really listen to Halsey but, the sample she posted sounded like HTDA to me, so, i'm down to give it a try.

[eachpassingphase]

Didn't Atticus do some work for a P!nk album a while back? So this isn't his first move into that world either.

Just looked it up - yep. He did programming for the album Try This! ​I would argue that P!nk is more radio friendly than Halsey is.

[sonic_discord]

I mean, i don't really listen to Halsey but, the sample she posted sounded like HTDA to me, so, i'm down to give it a try.

I also thought it sounded pretty reminiscent of HTDA, which I think is a good sign.

[Lerxto]

I also thought it sounded pretty reminiscent of HTDA, which I think is a good sign.

Yeah, the snippet sounds quite promising. What makes me a bit worrisome is most of her previous work does sound banal.
Musically and lyrically too simple, doesn't make me think or provides a new perspective on something.
Not that music for entertainment is bad, usually it's just not my thing.

If it turns out to be as half as good as NiggyTardust, Destroyer or Deaf Ears, I'd be more than content with this collaboration.

[thenorthwood]

I’m curious if the title of the album came from TR&AR or Halsey or all of the above. When I saw the picture of the billboard it drummed up an emotional response. Trent could teach a masterclass in how to get an emotional reaction. The black with the red slash reminds me of the Watchmen Volume 1&2 hype stickers. Unsettled, foreboading feeling from the combo.

I’m not that familiar with Halsey but I’m excited about this project. I feel like TR’s continued openness to new projects and experiences over the years has only benefitted his musical output.

[Haysey_Draws]

There's a small (but vocal) group of fans for ANY artist that only want their fav bands to just keep doing the same thing, churning out the same sound just to appease them. As soon as they go off that path they loose their shit "IT'S NOT ROCK" they cry. The great thing about TR is he NEVER sticks to path, he (and AR) are constantly looking for new sounds, new projects, new experiments. They could have quite easily just rested on NIN, re-releasing albums with a few bonus songs and best of tours, but that's never been their style. They've branched out into score work for a varity of stuff, producing, side projects, featuring with other artists. Sure some experiments don't work as well...but you don't learn anything without trying new shit, and they never half arse any of it.

This might work for a lot of fans, it might not, but i'm glad they are out there still experimenting, still going out of their perceived "comfort zone" and (in terms of Soul) reaping some great rewards. We're getting new NIN, they'll always be new NIN coming, but this is a nice bonus.

[chuckrh]

Looking forward to this. If it's as good as say the Flaming Lips/Miley Cyrus collaboration it could be monumental! Love how Trent & Atticus are continually trying new things.

[cdm]

As soon as they go off that path they loose their shit "IT'S NOT ROCK" they cry.

That's the really funny part about this to me...based on the [VERY SHORT] clips and the billboard imagery it really seems like they've pulled her closer to their sound rather than them trying to fit themselves into something poppy. I say that with the assumption that Halsey was a willing, probably enthusiastic, party in that evolution. Bottom line is people are going to bitch about literally everything and at the end of the day no one is going to pull your NINcard if you don't like this piece or that piece of TR output...although maybe we should consider it if it tones down the noise. I digress...

[mfte]

I am looking forward to this release. I anticipate sounding in line with HTDA, but less boring. My initial thought upon hearing the news was about how this will impact the writing and recording of the new NIN album.

As someone in this thread mentioned, it is nice to have fav music people remain active.

Let us all take a second to remember that TR was in talks with Aaliyah at one point about doing something together.

[Max]

I think it’s okay that Trent and Atticus are doing this and I think it’s okay to not be excited about the news. I don’t think you have to be writing off a whole genre to say, “I’m not excited about them producing a pop record.” I also wouldn’t be excited if they were producing a country album. And it also doesn’t matter whether I am excited or not because it’s not my life it’s theirs and they can do what they want, and I can like what I like.

Will I give it a listen? Yeah. Will I love it? Hard to imagine. Is it weird/sad/disappointing/shocking? Yep.Does it matter? No.

the best way that I can understand any of it is their whole thing about doing things outside their comfort zone like Soul and Mank. But also Bowie and how he veered in and out of the pop realm.

and maybe Trent’s age. I imagine he’s looking to build the next stage of his career and having to decide whether he is going to go The Rolling Stones route, or if he’s going to do something else. Maybe he is hitting the wizened guru stage and embracing it.

[henryeatscereal]

Had no idea who Halsey was, but i don't mind, all his production work is excellent, no matter what genre...

[variablebitrate]

I’m not shocked, but the thing I find interesting about so much of this conversation is how it’s framed as “TR+AR going pop” and not “Halsey going dark” (for lack of a better genre description). From the little bit we’ve heard and seen, it seems very obvious they were chosen for a reason and that their sonic fingerprint is going to be all over the thing. That why they’re there. I feel like I getting this vibe from everyone worried that this is somehow going to water down NIN or it’s the two of them selling out and changing everything, when the inverse is probably true and they were chosen as producers to have a large degree of input. You don’t make that choice and then impose rules on it (or you do, and that’s stupid, but hopefully that’s not true here). We’re prejudging and assuming it’s a pop album because of Halsey, but we don’t even know for sure that it is.

[jhulud]

I like the "Halsey going dark" mentality much better for the discussions so far. I'm a Halsey fan as well as plenty of other pop acts out there. From what I have seen and know of Halsey, she has been all over the place musically in her career: EDM backing sounds, pop punk, acoustic "rock", and plenty more. Having TR+AR on board with hew new album's production makes sense as not only is she a NIN fan...but also seems to be the "trend" as of late with a lot of the not-so mainstream indie pop acts. A lot of them have been embracing heavier and darker sounds and have been making a bigger splash with not only their own fanbases but also reached to others. It may have been mentioned previously here, but look at Poppy. She started out as what could be considered pop music and now she's evolved and veered into an industrial trap-metal sound.

Pop music these days is not what it used to be what some of us 90's kids heard back in those days. Shit has changed and been changing so fast it's oftentimes impossible to keep up.

[Demogorgon]

Pop has always followed the trends. It's basically short for "Popular" after all.