Trent Reznor on Rick Rubin Podcast Tetragrammaton

[botley]

I've been under a mis-apprehension then, was V all new material, while VI was re-purposed as you say? I'd always assumed both were TWITW.

We're all assuming they had some material left from multiple scores that made it into the mix for both albums, but this was never confirmed.

[tony.parente]

How does he know a full length record wouldn't work in todays climate, he hasn't released one in a decade

[Toadflax]

We're all assuming they had some material left from multiple scores that made it into the mix for both albums, but this was never confirmed.

To be fair, they released 2.5 hours of music less than two weeks after the pandemic went into full swing in the US, a time when Trent said he didn't feel like being creative. Sure, it's possible they were already working on new Ghosts material, but given the circumstances, it seems way more likely that they wanted to put something out for free to try and help people in a time of crisis and ended up repurposing discarded score work as a way of doing that. To be clear, I think that's great, but to the previous poster's point, it does tend to feel more like "here's some music you haven't heard" than "we set out to specifically make another Ghosts record."

[blassster]

In the Jimmy Iovine episode, around the 20 minute mark, Iovine says to Rick that TR/AR are working with Stevie Nicks on a song. No info beyond that. New news? Search brings up nothing recent, and I don't know anything about this musician.

[allegate]

They worked with Lindsey Buckingham for a track on the Halsey album so I guess they'll work with each member of the band eventually.

[trollmanen]

I've been under a mis-apprehension then, was V all new material, while VI was re-purposed as you say? I'd always assumed both were TWITW.

I don't think anyone knows for sure. From what I've read, people made the connection for Ghosts VI via the track titles and the fact that it was known the original score went unused. Both were released in March 2020, and the original message accompanying the release mentions "burning the midnight oil to complete these new Ghosts records". I can't imagine they made these both from scratch in March 2020, it seems more likely they had most of this stuff laying around and worked to finish things up to release them quickly. The artwork is extremely minimal as well, so if they had been working on this before then, I feel like there would be more to it.

[mfte]

How does he know a full length record wouldn't work in todays climate, he hasn't released one in a decade

A lot of us fans are projecting based on what TR might or might not have meant in regard to whatever era of his career he might have been referencing in his thoughts when he made the comments, but it isn't like Hesitation Marks set the music world ablaze. That album divided a lot of people, earned so-so sales (compared to the rest of the catalogue), had a big label push that resulted in an OK David Lynch music video and a few "meh" tv appearances and, for the most part, lives on in our collective memory because TR flipped off The Grammy's and the conversation about whatever the fuck "Everything" is.

Entirely possible that experience of releasing that LP in that climate soured the man.

I'd be happy with an on going series of EPs. They've been a proven success as definitive artistic statements in the NIN universe.

[tony.parente]

it isn't like Hesitation Marks set the music world ablaze.

Yeah but it resulted in the last time NIN would ever play St. Louis, but that's just a personal thing for me

[Deacon Blackfire]

If the Hesitation Marks cycle and the major label push that amounted to less than the sum of its parts factor into what he was talking about, it's because that period evidenced him trying to conquer what seems to be frustrating him here - his inability to reach new listeners out there beyond the barrier of the rapid fire news cycle media environment. After all, based on his statements at the time, the move back to Columbia and the major labels was mostly because he didn't want to have so many non-musical jobs on his plate with every release - as an independent artist he was basically tired of and uncomfortable with handling the business end of things and he felt that a) labels had changed in a way that made them a more supportive environment for artists and b) a major label's resources and research would help Nine Inch Nails material reach new listeners that he wasn't on his own. Ultimately that did not seem to be the case but it illustrates the fact that, as appreciative as Trent and his wallet are of us cultists here, he is not content to play to the same audience over and over again and is always hungry to expand his listener-base. He can rely on us to gobble up anything he puts out but these days, how do you really get the word out in a way that really makes an impression on culture at large? You need a sledgehammer of sorts, it's not a 'one size fits all' model, and quality frequently gets lost in the churning echo chamber of constantly generating content.

[Jazzkokehead]

A lot of us fans are projecting based on what TR might or might not have meant in regard to whatever era of his career he might have been referencing in his thoughts when he made the comments, but it isn't like Hesitation Marks set the music world ablaze. That album divided a lot of people, earned so-so sales (compared to the rest of the catalogue), had a big label push that resulted in an OK David Lynch music video and a few "meh" tv appearances and, for the most part, lives on in our collective memory because TR flipped off The Grammy's and the conversation about whatever the fuck "Everything" is.

Entirely my personal opinion - because I know there are many people who love the record - but I feel the reason Hesitation Marks had so-so sales is because it was a so-so album, not some kind of greater reflection on the music industry as a whole.

[WorzelG]

Probably fair to say it wouldn't set the world ablaze - but Satellite is an absolute banger of a pop song, not released as a single - ridiculous.

What's most entertaining to me, going back to people's comments at the time, was an entire thread lamenting the sales and suggesting it was ludicrous that NIN didn't outsell Ariana Grande! Ha ha

[ZeroisGreg]

Not sure if anybody noticed or looked it up but Tetragrammaton means God in Hebrew and the symbol is a cool-looking pentagram. Also, it's a funny coincidence that these letters look familiar.

https://ibb.co/0tPxjy1
https://ibb.co/VN6Vc0N

[Paul]

I thought this interview was excellent, one of his very best, and I should probably spend more time describing all the things I enjoyed about it.

But instead I will just say that I think it's completely possible / viable / desirable to have new NIN music without a tour. In fact it might be freeing to create new tracks without the concern of "but how are we going to play this live?". Just go for it. All out. God I want some new NIN so badly.

[simonn]

They worked with Lindsey Buckingham for a track on the Halsey album so I guess they'll work with each member of the band eventually.

He also played on 3 tacks on HM.....

[JustARandomGuy]

I haven't been here for a while and I came back when this news came around. I totally get Trent having kids and not wanting to tour, more power to him honestly, I would not be upset at Trent for such a decision, it's mature, understandable and respectable.


As a fan of NIN, I am disappointed that the new NIN is not close at all and my main core issue is the reason given, I just don't buy it, I come from a younger generation and I love albums, I love digesting them and I know for a fact I am not alone who still cares for albums in my age group (Early 20s). I think it's reductive to say that albums don't mean much anymore just because reviews don't make quite a big splash anymore...why is that something to upset yourself about? Nowadays what matters more is the listener, isn't that the way we should be going? I don't want some corporate Pitchfork assholes dictating what is good and what isn't. I'm confused as to why Trent is thinking about that either, I don't want another The Fragile Pitchfork review situation where some non-talented parasite pans an album just to satisfy his empty life. Why is this something Trent even thinks about? Unles I missunderstand but I just don't see how that would be desirable in any way


Trent also has not had a proper album released (in the normal sense of a word) since 2013 Hesitation Marks. After that, we had a collection of EPs (which I've loved) but I am confused as to how that was supposed to be better for the "modern times" as Trent put it, I am of the strong belief that the release method actually hurt the visibility of these amazing records in the long run. The fact Trent thinks this was the better way to go just seems absurd to me. So how he can speak about how much people "care" about albums if he hasn't had a proper album release in at least a decade? He didn't expect the EPs with minimum hype, advertisements, singles, and music videos to get a lot of attention, right? (Except for Less Than, of course).

And even then even with the label backing, Hesitation Marks was not marketed super well, the music video it got was an awful and they could have seriously picked better main single as well. A lot of lost opportunities.


I can guarantee that if Nine Inch Nails were to release a 13-14-track long album with proper build-up and hype, it would get insane coverage and attention, 2020s feels like the perfect time for this type of music to come back, which is another thing I disagree with on Trent - this not being the time for NIN. I think it absolutely is, if there is any time for NIN to make a big splash it'd be now. Deftones are utterly huge and their latest album was successful. Queens Of The Stone Age and Foo Fighters had amazing albums released this month to great acclaim and great sales, and a lot of attention.


I don't know where Trent is looking to have such a bleak view of how music is viewed. But if anything the importance of albums to people is coming back, places like RateYourMusic, which are polluted with young people, people who care about music are blooming, that site has not been this big, ever. It doesn't add up to me where these statements are coming from. I find them a little confusing but most importantly depressing since they feel incredibly self-defeating.


In the end though, it's clear that Trent creativity for him is now found to be in the soundtracks, it wouldn't surprise me if the time when Trent puts NIN forever to rest and entirely devotes himself to soundtracks will come soon, it might sound melodramatic from me but I don't mean it to be, Trent should do whatever he wants to do creatively, he has nothing left to prove, he has left an enormous impact on music as a whole. He can do whatever, who I am of all people to tell him what to do? That's not the tone I want to give off. I respect Trent and his creative future endeavours. I won't be upset if NIN was put to rest forever, Trent gave me a shit ton of music already.


I only take issue with his reasoning given which he gave that I disagree with. As the thought of albums being disposable is not felt by me at all.

[botley]

I come from a younger generation and I love albums, I love digesting them and I know for a fact I am not alone who still cares for albums in my age group (Early 20s). I think it's reductive to say that albums don't mean much anymore just because reviews don't make quite a big splash anymore...why is that something to upset yourself about?

I don't think that's a fair characterization of what Reznor said, he was just using the fact that music reviews are beyond passe now as an example of the broader shift away from people in large numbers engaging deeply with albums as art these days. There will always be people who continue to do that, of course. Your example of people gathering on RateYourMusic is a good one, but that's incredibly niche compared to most spaces people hang out in these days.

So how he can speak about how much people "care" about albums if he hasn't had a proper album release in at least a decade? He didn't expect the EPs with minimum hype, advertisements, singles, and music videos to get a lot of attention, right? (Except for Less Than, of course).

Elsewhere in the interview, he says that going independent in 2008 and subsequently working for Beats/Apple made him think a lot about how music is consumed in this century and how best to help people pay more attention to it. But my reading is that after Hesitation Marks, he lost interest with trying to make a big splash with NIN because of the inevitable disappointment that brings. There's no pleasing everyone, so they're just out to please themselves — and if they don't feel right about spending months and months slaving away over an epic journey of an album, and thinking deeply about every facet of it as the next big statement for NIN, then it's probably not going to happen.

That could change. But if they're feeling like there's an uphill battle just to stand out and be heard, then I could see how that does make the psychological toll of putting out new music extra draining (TR spoke about this on Song Exploder episode for "The Lovers", where he was asked if it was cathartic/therapeutic to visit such dark personal territory again for NIN... and pretty much said "no").

Maybe if things had been different in 2020 and there had been a huge outpouring of public recognition and so forth with a big splashy Rock and Roll Hall of Fame induction, there might have been a cultural tipping point where it felt like NIN was relevant to the broader cultural conversation. But the pandemic kind of took the wind out of everyone's sails, and that's more the core reason we haven't had a new album yet, in my opinion. A lot of artists took years to feel inspired again, some are still finding their way there. That's okay. It's been hard.

[Toadflax]

It's very strange that at least 2 people on this thread have said that Trent not releasing a traditional album in 10 years means he couldn't possibly know how people feel about albums these days. Huh? That's like saying only a cook can know how food tastes. Also, this is in the same thread where plenty of people are talking about how people feel about albums these days, through presumably most of them haven't released an album in the past 10 years, either.

[BRoswell]

It's very strange that at least 2 people on this thread have said that Trent not releasing a traditional album in 10 years means he couldn't possibly know how people feel about albums these days. Huh? That's like saying only a cook can know how food tastes. Also, this is in the same thread where plenty of people are talking about how people feel about albums these days, through presumably most of them haven't released an album in the past 10 years, either.

Exactly. Even if Trent hasn't put out a full length album in a decade, he's still aware of trends in music, and he's still aware of where Nine Inch Nails stands in terms of popularity. That's exactly why he doesn't want to become a nostalgia act. To be honest, I like what Trent & Atticus did with the EP trilogy. Each one was short, sweet, and to the point, and it let the music breathe a bit too. I can't really blame him for not wanting to go the traditional route of putting out a big album and touring for a year to support it, especially when Nine Inch Nails is not really a huge draw anymore and he's got a family to take care of. I don't think they're going to hang up Nine Inch Nails just yet, but things have definitely changed, and I think Trent would rather just roll with it and do what feels right instead of forcing himself to conform to whatever trends there are.

[Demogorgon]

I'd like to see more collaborations, honestly. Like, full album collabs as opposed to a song here and there. The album with Halsey is great, and I'm not even a fan of pop music or Halsey in general. I'd buy an album like that again.

[tony.parente]

It's very strange that at least 2 people on this thread have said that Trent not releasing a traditional album in 10 years means he couldn't possibly know how people feel about albums these days. Huh? That's like saying only a cook can know how food tastes. Also, this is in the same thread where plenty of people are talking about how people feel about albums these days, through presumably most of them haven't released an album in the past 10 years, either.

Man i just want new music and one last real tour (not just LA/NY/CHI shows) before he tosses in the hat lol

[JustARandomGuy]

That could change. But if they're feeling like there's an uphill battle just to stand out and be heard, then I could see how that does make the psychological toll of putting out new music extra draining (TR spoke about this on Song Exploder episode for "The Lovers", where he was asked if it was cathartic/therapeutic to visit such dark personal territory again for NIN... and pretty much said "no").

I remember this very vividly and I found it a little alarming, I really don't want Trent to put himself into uncomfortable situations just for the art's sake. Especially if there is no carthasis anymore, I'd rather for Trent to stop making NIN if he feels he needs to force himself like that. I don't believe anyone should do that to themselves.

Maybe it'd be nice to see Trent indulge in some side-project that could be lighter and more fun for a lack of a better word, something that doesn't demand for dark personal themes, it's not like Trent didn't try this with NIN itself, I feel that people's reaction to Everything could have been very defeatening to him.

But I guess he has soundtracks for that already. I am really curious how that Ninja Turtles OS will sound like, seems like it will be the silliest, most light-hearted movie Trent composed for thus far so I wonder what tunes he will make for that one.

It's very strange that at least 2 people on this thread have said that Trent not releasing a traditional album in 10 years means he couldn't possibly know how people feel about albums these days. Huh? That's like saying only a cook can know how food tastes. Also, this is in the same thread where plenty of people are talking about how people feel about albums these days, through presumably most of them haven't released an album in the past 10 years, either.

Exactly. Even if Trent hasn't put out a full length album in a decade, he's still aware of trends in music, and he's still aware of where Nine Inch Nails stands in terms of popularity. That's exactly why he doesn't want to become a nostalgia act. To be honest, I like what Trent & Atticus did with the EP trilogy. Each one was short, sweet, and to the point, and it let the music breathe a bit too. I can't really blame him for not wanting to go the traditional route of putting out a big album and touring for a year to support it, especially when Nine Inch Nails is not really a huge draw anymore and he's got a family to take care of. I don't think they're going to hang up Nine Inch Nails just yet, but things have definitely changed, and I think Trent would rather just roll with it and do what feels right instead of forcing himself to conform to whatever trends there are.

It has more to do with me seeing reactions to other rock albums released recently being pretty positive received and getting plenty of attention, and I do feel like I'm seeing NIN being discussed amongst young people more and more, part of me can't but internally believe that Trent's cynicism is painting a far more of a bleak image of everything. I do believe NIN is stlil relavant and that new NIN album wouldn't go unnoticed and just believe personally that the opposite is true

I do disagree with the idea of NIN not "being a huge draw anymore", especially considering how sucesflul the live shows been to this day.
No one's also forcing Trent to tour when he releases music, he could simply just release music and not care how it would be played live as David Bowie did during The Next Day era where he pretty much said "fuck it".

But yeah, if Trent feels it isn't time for NIN it's not time for NIN, I respect that, more than anything I guess a big part of me dislike this sort of a "self-defeatening" feeling I get behind what he is saying and it's a little sad. Especially since I feel like it's Trent perhaps being a little too pesimistic on music today while not seeing the good things amongst audiences still.

[stlkr]

I just want to whine/rant a bit regarding touring.

NiN has played only two gigs in my country.
I couldn't afford for tickets for both of the shows.
Now when I finally can afford for it - no more touring.
Just like Skinny Puppy - 40 years, two gigs in Poland and that's all.
I am glad that SP tickets weren't expensive.
I feel kinda bummed. Always wanted to see NiN perform live.
Just like COIL but now... It is just a dream.

[WorzelG]

I just want to whine/rant a bit regarding touring.

NiN has played only two gigs in my country.
I couldn't afford for tickets for both of the shows.
Now when I finally can afford for it - no more touring.
Just like Skinny Puppy - 40 years, two gigs in Poland and that's all.
I am glad that SP tickets weren't expensive.
I feel kinda bummed. Always wanted to see NiN perform live.
Just like COIL but now... It is just a dream.

I wouldn't take what he says about touring so much to heart, he's said it so many times before, it's like he's trying to convince himself rather than others and then I bet he'll get the itch again. I just think some people were born performers, and it's just who they are

[sweeterthan]

he wants to hang with his kids so you know what that means?
3 words: reznor family band.

[BRoswell]

he wants to hang with his kids so you know what that means?
3 words: reznor family band.

I mean, he did say that the first album he owned was from The Partridge Family. Bring it full circle!

[ZeroisGreg]

What does any of this have to do with Trent Reznor on Rick Rubin Podcast Tetragrammaton??

[Zimbo]

Yeah but it resulted in the last time NIN would ever play St. Louis, but that's just a personal thing for me

They didn't even play Wisconsin for HM. They haven't played Wisconsin since [WITH_TEETH].

[botley]

Someone on the official Discord server bumped into Atticus on the London Underground today, and apparently he said they will "probably" come back to play the UK again next year.

So, let's try not to read too much into TR kvetching on his friend's podcast about what may or may not be in NIN's future plans.

[tony.parente]

They didn't even play Wisconsin for HM. They haven't played Wisconsin since [WITH_TEETH].

Yikes, both our states got boned due to the chicago effect.

[sonic_discord]

Someone on the official Discord server bumped into Atticus on the London Underground today, and apparently he said they will "probably" come back to play the UK again next year.

So, let's try not to read too much into TR kvetching on his friend's podcast about what may or may not be in NIN's future plans.

So, what you're saying is that I need to start planning a trip to Europe next year JUST in case THOSE are the last shows they ever play?